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Dead Wild Roses 
9 comments
November 25, 2010 at 11:40 am
Moe
I thankful to be secular!
Have a fine Thanksgiving my young freind.
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November 25, 2010 at 11:48 am
Vern R. Kaine
Yes, Happy Thanksgiving (belated for Canadians!)
Re: the video, it’s a fun exercise to have my religious friends explain (or try to explain) these differences, and then ask them who’s going to hell. :)
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November 25, 2010 at 6:52 pm
Alan Scott
The Arbourist,
I have to admit that is an argument I have never heard before. The disunity within the Christian religion being proof that God does not exist. I assume the reverse can’t possibly be true. Those who do not believe in God are not One, so why using counter logic does that not prove there must be a God?
At least I know who I am thankful to. I would hate to have to thank chance or luck when things go right.
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November 25, 2010 at 10:36 pm
The Arbourist
Thanks Moe, you too. :) We had our thanksgiving already, but the weekend is just around the corner and I am thankful for that.
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November 26, 2010 at 12:04 am
Mystro
AS – Those who do not believe in God are not One, so why using counter logic does that not prove there must be a God?
Because, as atheism does not make any claims about what is, which means that it does NOT claim that atheism will lead to unity.
The vid shows that the bible/christianity DOES say that the way jesus (aka christians’ god) planned to prove himself was to make christianity one. But that sure didn’t happen. Thus, christianity fails its own proof.
AS-At least I know who I am thankful to. I would hate to have to thank chance or luck when things go right.
You might try thanking the people who actually contributed to making things go right. You know, the ones who actually did something to earn the credit. For example, if someone makes you dinner, thank the person who prepared the food and gave it to you for your meal, not some invisible, intangible, unable-and/or-unwilling-to-make-Kraft-Dinner deity.
PS – “counter logic”? I may be wrong, but it sounds like you just invented that term. I responded to your post as if you meant ‘same logic’. Please let me know if I misunderstood.
The only counters to logic I can think of are insanity and irrationality. And those aren’t so much counters as they are blinders. They don’t actually refute logic, they just make the insane/irrational unaware that they’re wrong. I’m sure you understand.
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November 26, 2010 at 8:20 am
Vern R. Kaine
Mystro: You may have to also translate “Kraft Dinner” (not for me, though, I grew up on it!) :)
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November 26, 2010 at 6:04 pm
Alan Scott
Mystro,
I do not have all of the answers, but using the fact that Jesus prayed that his followers become one, and two thousand years later they are not, really is not the strongest argument against belief in Christianity. Those of us who consider themselves believers have far more troubling questions which we cannot answer and can only trust in our faith .
The biggest unanswerable question that comes to mind is why do bad things happen to good people. Why does one person get cancer at a young age while some other person lives to one hundred. It must be great to be an Atheist and never have to ponder difficult moral questions.
But to get back to the original point. Why does Jesus even have to pray to his Father? Why doesn’t God just know before hand and take care of it? Or why doesn’t Jesus make food as the devil tells him to when Jesus is fasting in the wilderness?
The answer has to be the limitations put on Jesus when he was put on the earth as a mortal. When Jesus is praying that his followers become one, at the time he is concerned about his disciples, particularly when he is gone. As they spread out through the Roman World, whether they would all stay on the same message was obviously a concern.
I think I can argue with validity that on the central points of there being a God and Jesus being his Son, most of the Christian Churches are one. As most things in the Bible tend to be inexact, I believe there is enough ambiguity in the concept of what ‘ one ‘ really means to make my case.
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November 27, 2010 at 11:50 pm
Mystro
AS-The biggest unanswerable question that comes to mind is why do bad things happen to good people.
Actually, that is very easy to answer. It is because there is no god. If there was, the situations you described wouldn’t occur.
AS-It must be great to be an Atheist and never have to ponder difficult moral questions.
Once again, you have it backwards. The more a person accepts a given faith, the less they have to ponder morality. One who has absolute faith need not ponder at all. What’s right, a or b? Bible says a, so a it is. Done.
It is only when one engages in critical thought (the antithesis of religious thought) that any moral questions even arise.
AS-I think I can argue with validity
It’s nice that you’re optimistic
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November 28, 2010 at 10:12 am
Alan Scott
Mystro,
” One who has absolute faith need not ponder at all. What’s right, a or b? Bible says a, so a it is. Done. ”
There is where you have it ‘backwards’. I know a lot of religious people, apparently you do not. You only seem to know what you see on TV or read about. The only thing they have absolute Faith in is life after death. The world constantly throws up events that challenge everything they believe. I’m glad that never happens to you.
” It is because there is no god. ”
Then it does no harm for other people to believe in one. You really only object to the rules religious people force on your kind. I guess the biggest is anti abortion. Yet can’t someone who is an Atheist be pro life? Can’t organizations who promote all the other sins you hate, just be filled with Atheists? You said they are not all of ” one ” mind. I mean if believers are just suckers as you see them, what do you care ?
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