Here is a just a snapshot of what it’s like…
“What’s on my mind, Facebook? Glad you asked.
I am angry.
I’m angry because before I moved to the UK, I worked at a bar where the manager proposed a new uniform where the men wore waistcoats and button up shirts, while the women wore corsets. And no one saw the problem with that.
I’m angry because when I told him that if I wanted to wear that I’d be a stripper and earn ten times more, my coworkers were embarrassed and looked away.
I’m angry because even though he eventually admitted that my objections were valid, this incident (“Corsetgate,” I like to call it) is not remembered as the time I defended myself and my female coworkers from being objectified at work, but rather as the time that I “totally flipped out.”I’m angry because when I threw a customer out of the bar for grabbing me (twice, once after I explicitly told him it was unacceptable), I was asked repeatedly where exactly he grabbed me. As if there is some ranking system as to what must happen before I am allowed to feel violated by a stranger’s hands on me.
I am angry because the (female) bouncer told me afterward that his behavior was a compliment to me. I’m angry because she believes that. Because misogyny is so much a part of our society that women really believe that their bodies aren’t their own.
I’m angry because last night, out at some random club in London, a man walked up behind me and thrusted against me. And when I told him to get the hell away
from me, he moved on to another woman who was too drunk to say the same thing.
I’m angry because when I asked the bouncer to throw him out, he told me I was overreacting. I’m angry that when I decided to stand up for myself, my friends told me I was overreacting.I’m angry because my reaction, my refusal to allow myself to be treated as a subhuman slab of meat, is perceived as an overreaction.
I’m angry because men have a monopoly on anger. Because when I, a woman, am angry, it’s either “cute” or it’s “crazy.” It is never acknowledged that I could be a sensible, intelligent, educated person with a justifiable concern. Of course not. I’m a woman. (And a blonde at that. Strike two!)
If my boyfriend had punched Pelvic Thrust Guy out, he would have been applauded. Whereas my impulse to simply inform PTG that I was displeased with his behavior was met with a chorus of “Just let it go!” “We just don’t want to see you so upset!” “It’s not worth it!”
I’m angry because I was made to feel like I was being unreasonable for expecting to be treated with basic human decency. And PTG just strolled out of that bar without consequence. I cried all night, and he probably spent the rest of the night gleefully groping women who were too afraid or too brainwashed to speak up.
I’m angry because this (and much, MUCH worse) happens every day. And it happens everywhere, from small towns in West Virginia to great cities like London. To me, and to every other woman on the planet. And we’re still not allowed to be angry.
I am angry. And you should be too.”






89 comments
January 17, 2016 at 10:52 am
jasonjshaw
I’d be curious to know where he was directing people to harass anyone – it has not been something I can recall occurring in his videos.
Also, he does not seem to specifically target women. He tends to target people who are making money off of misinforming the public. Just because a couple of those people are women does not mean he is targeting women.
I’ll give you #3 – it actually sounds like there could potentially be some meat to it – though there is no direct quote from him as evidence.
The rest is associative and 3rd party evidence – the reliability of which is questionable at best. It’s like trusting the Toronto Sun for unbiased political commentary.
If he is so out-to-lunch on feminism, surely there must be some direct quotes from him that could be presented to demonstrate that. You know, actual evidence.
Also, I don’t see the problem with Men’s Rights (I’m assuming MRA is Men’s Rights Associations?). I would hope their focus would be on equality as well. Painting them with a broad stroke of negativity seems rather hypocritical of someone who associates with feminism. Men tend to get the short end of the stick in some areas of life as well. A focus on equality should be just that, a focus on equality.
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January 17, 2016 at 11:01 am
jasonjshaw
Where have I ever suggested that women and men experience society roughly the same?
You seem to keep putting words into my mouth. There are differences, for sure. Not all differences are positive for men and negative for women though. The way you approach the subject makes it seem like you believe that only men benefit from the way society functions.
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January 17, 2016 at 11:05 am
carmen
Have you been under a rock for the last few years??? Do you not know about the controversy at Freethought Blogs? Do you know how long he lasted on that forum? I think it was a week? Do you REALIZE why people like Ed Brayton, Richard Carrier, Greta Christina, etc. have only negative things to say about him? Straight up, JJ – it was because of his immediate attacks on feminists and his misogynistic rants that he was booted out of that forum.
Get your shit together – do some research. Like I told you before, the fact that you are a worshiping Thunderfoot disciple says it all – it’d be like having the mark of the beast in some circles.
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January 17, 2016 at 11:05 am
jasonjshaw
Seeing balances is not the rocket science you seem to make it out to be.
Again, I’m seeing the parallels with belief systems – this is an argument I would expect to see from a Christian. It’s making more and more sense why the thoughts I’m presenting are going right over your head.
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January 17, 2016 at 11:43 am
The Arbourist
@JJshaw
Precisely. Society is constructed for the benefit of the class of individuals known as men. This is what Patriarchy is.
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January 17, 2016 at 11:54 am
The Arbourist
@JJshaw
Oh but it certainly seems to be. Because the assumptions you make are, and have been, proven wrong. Yet you continue forward, not learning, not reading, not being charitable.
You mean the thoughts of a man defending the system that benefits him while actively looking away from evidence that suggests that things are not so hot for the class of people that do not happen to be men?
*lolsob forever* – Are you here thinking that somehow your arguments are original? Men not getting feminism is so far back in feminist wheelhouse that entire FAQ’s have been written on the topic, just to allay threads like this.
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January 17, 2016 at 12:13 pm
jasonjshaw
Again, I would like to see evidence. No one seems to have any actual evidence of him being the problem. Everything is hearsay accusations. You seem to be in-the-know on this issue, can’t you provide even a little bit of evidence to support your position?
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January 17, 2016 at 12:13 pm
The Arbourist
@JJshaw
Oh I see. It is just a strange coincidence that the death threats, online harassment, doxxing etc against women mentioned by TF in his video happened after he posted said videos.
Someone took the time to analyse TF.
TF then says that:
“The problem is that many in leadership positions have managed to get themselves bullied or cajoled into this bullshit PC appeasement position by people who are conspicuous in that they proudly label themselves as feminists.”
Behind this description, he scrolls a list of people, including me, who wrote articles for Skepchick last year, on the topic of speaking out against hate directed at women. Did TF even read those articles, I wonder? Because, if he did, I am unclear as to why he would choose to describe them in these terms.
These are articles encouraging people to behave in an ethical, compassionate way towards the women in our community, and to stand alongside those women when they face verbal or physical threats either online or in real life. What possible reason could TF have to be sickened by these appeals?
Even if everything else in his video was 100% accurate, even if the people he is attacking were actually worse than he believes them to be, TF should still support appeals for people to speak out against hate directed at women. That is is a very basic, rock-bottom, minimalistic ethical position that he should be able to publicly support alongside his other concerns about some people’s behavior.
—–
Thunderf00t then attacks Rebecca Watson:
“Well, take for instance the professional victims, who went from conference to conference telling people each time that the sexual harassment at those conferences was so bad that they were literally putting their lives on the line merely by turning up…”
Which he illustrates with video of Rebecca saying:
“You can’t trust the cops, you can’t trust people to believe your story, you can’t trust the people who hang out with you at these events, you can’t trust the leaders of our community to give a damn.”
TF then says:
“…that was so dangerous that they had to go around in pairs”
Which he illustrates with video of Rebecca saying:
“So at the conference, all of the Skepchick writers who were there instituted a buddy system, in which we always travelled together, or with a male escort, and especially when returning to hotel rooms late at night.”
I assume that TF is unaware of this, but the two video extracts that he showed of Rebecca were taken out of context, and even in the wrong sequence, from a speech in which she was talking about a far wider range of issues than harassment at conferences.
The conclusion drawn from the analysis:
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January 17, 2016 at 12:17 pm
jasonjshaw
And there’s your problem with one-sidedness. I would agree that certainly things lean toward men, but to suggest absolutely everything is better for men is utter nonsense.
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January 17, 2016 at 12:20 pm
jasonjshaw
What assumptions, that feminism is supposed to be about equality? The way you’re presenting it, it seems to be more about a creating matriarchy to oppose the patriarchy. I see that as a fundamentally flawed approach if the end goal is equality.
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January 17, 2016 at 12:23 pm
carmen
. .. and there we FINALLY have it. . .” I would agree that things lean toward men”
Now go do some research. Women’s Studies 101 would be a start.
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January 17, 2016 at 12:27 pm
jasonjshaw
What are you talking about? I’m not oblivious to it, but I also know it is far more nuanced than I see it being made out to be. Is it because I’m male and I think critically that I’m automatically assumed to be an enemy?
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January 17, 2016 at 12:32 pm
carmen
The typical MRA response, “Women just want to be in charge; they want to replace men; they want to be the boss!”
No, JJ. Again – Women’s Studies 101
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January 17, 2016 at 12:36 pm
jasonjshaw
“It is just a strange coincidence that the death threats, online harassment, doxxing etc against women mentioned by TF in his video happened after he posted said videos. ”
Correlation =/= causation. Just because others were outraged and took things too far doesn’t incriminate him for presenting his observations. Where does he tell anyone to do such a thing? What about those on Sarkeesian’s side that ventured attacks in his direction?
Ah, a direct personal connection to the situation. I can see better where you’re coming from now.
But thank you for providing some actual evidence. Now I do see some meat to your perspective.
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January 17, 2016 at 12:38 pm
jasonjshaw
Is it typical, or is it citing the extreme example and unfairly applying it to all? I would suspect the latter, as that commonly happens with critics of any movement.
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January 17, 2016 at 12:43 pm
The Arbourist
@JJshaw
Now you are ignoring evidence. I’ll repost…
2. Featured on A Voice for Men. Thus endorsed by AVFM, who are rabidly misogynistic, hate group. A little quote describing AVFM:
“The last issue of the SPLC’s Intelligence Report presented a scathing portrait of “a hard-line fringe” of the Men’s Rights Movement (MRM): “women haters whose fury goes well beyond criticism of the family court system, domestic violence laws, and false rape accusations,” whose rage is “directed at all women, not only perceived feminists.”
Yea so MRA’s approve of Dr.Phil’s message. That should be enough right there.
Being endorsed by AVFM is the all the evidence necessary, at least to reasonable people. Clearly, you seem to be falling outside of that category.
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January 17, 2016 at 1:05 pm
jasonjshaw
Just because what he does fits with their views does not mean he necessarily supports their problem views. If white supremacists endorse a successful white basketball player, does that make the basketball player a white supremacist? No, it does not.
That’s not credible evidence.
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January 17, 2016 at 1:10 pm
carmen
Are you banging your head on the desk yet, Arb??
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January 17, 2016 at 1:15 pm
The Arbourist
@Carmen
Yeah, I always hope that *this* is one that might listen to reason.
Sometimes I’m surprised, but most of the time I’m really not. :)
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January 17, 2016 at 7:55 pm
VR Kaine
Mr. Shaw coming into a crowd like this saying the things he does, but at least he has the guts to say it, and the willingness to read the posts here.
Does anyone here seriously read and discuss anything online in forums that are anchored in far more Conservative views?
I don’t and can’t speak for him, but one of the points I find in his comments is that someone doesn’t have to “dig deep into critical body of feminist work” – there’s hypocrisy, extremism, and message confusion even on the surface.
From that, and a point which I do think Mr. Shaw is making – who gives a shit about the literature, just look at the results: there is a clear lack of them which one could easily attribute to the hypocrisy, extremism, and message confusion found even in the most common and simple corners of the movement that apparently only Caitlyn Jenner or some marshmallow-puff of a man is allowed to call out or make reference to?
“Oh, you can’t dare comment because you haven’t read the thousands of volumes of not only boring, but also useless and ineffective texts that would make you (somehow) qualified”.
OK, I guess – or how about the suggestion that you all alienate more than you attract to your cause, and that perhaps you should hire a branding or marketing expert to get your message clear before you pick some poor pinata in here to start ripping the guy apart like you’re all the mob in the Handmaiden’s Tale?
You ask 10 people and you get 10 definitions of not only what Feminism is, but also a whole bunch of rules from liberals as to who’s allowed to even utter the word? Y’all aren’t a movement – at best (at least right now) you’re a GroupThink mob by many accounts, therefore I for one don’t see the “wrong” in Mr. Shaw calling aspects of that out, whether he feels he’s witnessing it here or elsewhere. He’s got to read a whole bunch of dry, academic, inconsequential textbooks from authors *you* choose before you all can engage him? How about answering the question of why so many women are feminine and yet not Feminists with something a little more academic than, “Well, um… they must be brainwashed”?
Oh, and the *sighs* are a nice touch, btw. Touchingly melodramatic – oh the plight of the Feminist Blogger!!! Is there a safe room with puppies and cookies close by? ;)
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January 18, 2016 at 3:40 am
carmen
How about this one, VRCaine ?
. … eyeroll . . . and then – head shake . . .
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January 18, 2016 at 9:48 am
The Arbourist
@Vern
Well, here we be I suppose we should get at it.
Is it really so brave for JJshaw come here, spout his ignorant to quasi-ignorant arguments and then not learn when provided with answers/counter-arguments? Let’s not paint too widely with the brush of heroism, shall we?
Regularly. However, I try not to comment as I usually have my own dedicated shit-storms to deal with (see this thread). :)
Oh fuck ya, because knowing what you’re talking about is completely optional. Or is it because we’re talking about a topic that you don’t think is serious, because holly-damn batman the above statement is going to bite you in the ass when we talk economics and politics. Because hey, let’s raise income tax to 90% for the most wealthy in society, why, because I think its good idea. Or yeah, minimum wage should be $20 dollars an hour, but I don’t want to get into detail about economics and how shit like that works – I’m just gonna say shit and hope it sticks and even suggesting that I read up on some economics 101 is out of the question.
I look forward to our next nuanced economic debate, given the above criteria.
Anything CJ says about feminism should treated as dudes trying to explain what feminism is all about. Most likely it is inaccurate and probably self-serving.
The cause is about dismantling the structures of society that oppress women. This is often done at a direct loss of privilege to men. Sugar coating this idea will not make its appeal any more likable to men. How could it?
As profoundly fond as I am of repeating myself to reinforce basic conceptions, it becomes tiresome after awhile, especially when individuals actively choose ignorance over the insight being offered. Not refuting, not arguing, just plain ‘ole ignoring stuff. So, when we get to discuss why equality doesn’t work in a fundamentally unequal society for nth time I get cranky. I’m allowed; I’m old and not responsible for doing basic education on the internet. I spend my days doing that with the happy addition of being paid for it.
For him not to sound like a complete knob, it would certainly be a start now wouldn’t it. But fuck it, I think we should more socialist in Canada – why? Because I have opinions and feelings and I shouldn’t have to even touch a book or read up on the historical context because that’s hard. But I also expect people who actually know shit to give me the time of day when I flail into their discussions.
I’m pretty sure you’ve done Sociology 101 and understand about socialization and how that works – or would you like me to explain basic sociology to you? Or maybe not, because what’s all that shit in textbooks and stuff all about anyways? Probably more egghead propaganda! – lets just go on common sense and your very important opinions instead, because making informed arguments is hard.
Thanks. It’s tiresome dealing with bloviating, clueless, self-important dudes who are mostly clueless yet still claim to talk and argue with authority that is apparent only to them. I’m glad you understand. :)
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January 18, 2016 at 10:39 am
roughseasinthemed
@ Arb
This is a fundamental point that nicey nicey feminists and humanists and equalists seem to miss. Ergo, that’s why is doesn’t happen. Because a few of those menz out there have worked that one out too.
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January 18, 2016 at 9:33 pm
VR Kaine
“… and then not learn… Let’s not paint too widely with the brush of heroism, shall we?”
Ahh, Liberal Academic Arrogance rears its head yet again. You *demand* that he learn? You’re the teacher here? I didn’t say he’s a hero and you know it – I just said he has guts which by your own admission you don’t when it comes to commenting on more Conservative blogs. What was your “excuse” again? Oh yeah, right here…
“I try not to comment because I usually have my own shit storms to deal with here.”
Really, Arb? This is what qualifies to you as a “shit storm”? Some words on a blog? Remember the location of that safe room, dude! Sounds like you’re going to need it. Either way, though, nice try – seems instead like you’d just rather prefer your own echo chamber and group hugs here.
“I’m just going to say shit and hope it sticks, and reading up on Economics 101 is out of the question.”
Haha. Nice try, Arb. To run a business someone needs to simply understand “buy low, sell high”. They don’t need to touch a single textbook to have power of insight or observation, yet you clearly believe those two things are impossible unless someone does – and worse, a textbook of your choosing (reminds me of Liberals christening those who they thought were ‘legitimate’ economists). You can also reference that Vice article I shared and say that it’s bullshit that the people of PNG are being exploited by Exxon/Mobil. You’re saying you need an Economics or Sociology degree for that? Again – Liberal Arrogance at its finest. All Mr. Shaw is saying – and there’s evidence of it everywhere – is that even intelligent, successful women think the DEGREE that you take the “Feminism” fight and actions to is ridiculous and something they don’t want to be a part of. He’s saying couldn’t you perhaps dial it back, you’re saying no – nothing gets solved (fine), but then look at where you take the rest of the conversation. Oh, poor me, oh, the burden of me having to sink to your intellectual level and explain things – AS THOUGH ANYONE (including Mr. Shaw) ASKED YOU TO.
He’s saying the rhetoric from your side gets to be so toxic that people stop giving a shit what you’re saying, which would be fine except it’s people like him who you’re trying to ultimately bring on side, because as you’ve also acknowledged, he’s the mainstream. Enter my point that you have no concept of leadership or influence because you constantly tear down, which is also the man’s point. The end result? You can talk lots, feel smart, get lots of hugs and pats and kudos here, but beyond that, achieve nothing for your cause. Your perspective is the only perspective and your approach is THE approach no matter how inefficient or ineffective it might be, because dammit, look at how academically sound it is!!! Do you ever TRY another approach, or another perspective? Even charities take lessons from Coca-Cola. If you actually wanted results on your side, you might try that sometime and on that note, perhaps ask Mr. Shaw to (try and) elaborate before shoving a bunch of Wikipedia pages and textbooks in his face saying, “Get as smart as I am first before you talk to me.”
“So when we get to discuss why equality doesn’t work… for nth time I get cranky.”
Ahh, the classic Liberal move of “let me introduce my oh-so-hurt feelings” so that what, people back off? Or is it simply to pile on to the already huge pile of perpetual victimhood that’s miles high in here sometimes? Blogs and comments get you “cranky”? Seriously? You poor thing!!! How do you cope? Oh yeah – right – the SAFE ROOMS. That, of course, and a thousand “there there now’s” I’m sure. How exhausting it must be for you, oh wise one, to be descend upon the bottom-dwellers all the time to educate them (as if they asked you to).
“Anything CJ says about Feminism should be treated as dudes trying to explain what Feminism is all about.”
Ahh, right. Because you’re the authority on it. You. A white dude. You’ve now told the rest of the world what they should think, and not only that, you’re apparently more of an authority on Feminism than what, most women now? That must be a MAGIC textbook you read from, Arb, to make you such a Grand Wizard. “All Things Feminist, Just Only Through Arb.”
“It’s tiresome dealing with bloviating, clueless….”
Awww. Here’s a cookie. You must be SOOO tired. A hard day teaching being mostly away from the real world, and then what? A hard day typing being mostly out of the real world yet again? Exhausting, I’m sure. And how dare anyone claim to talk and argue with authority.
I don’t think Mr. Shaw was ever claiming to be an authority on the subject of Feminism, Arb. He’s saying – best I can tell – that based on both simple AND plentiful empirical evidence your anti-whatever and belittle-whomever stance doesn’t seem to be winning over anyone except those more who are already on your side, who you get to intellectually circle-jerk with.
In business terms, a customer who is clueless on how to make a widget is qualified to be a customer if he or she is someone I want buying from my store. They don’t need a PhD in widgets, they just need to tell me why they’re not buying, and if I want them as a customer (and people like them), then it’s MY job to understand them and adjust to meet their needs. If I took your approach and simply sat back in a huff and puff bitching about how stupid my customer is, or sat back waiting for them to learn about widgets, or worst of all – demand that they learn about them – I’D BE BROKE. “Broke” as in unsuccessful, as in a failure in my mission and my cause to capture market share, add value to someone’s life and to society, and create loyal customers.
Now take all those quaint liberal causes you try to champion here – any new “customers”? None that I can see. Except myself to a degree, none that I can see.
If you ever once read from the other side I’d hear even a hint of it in your discourse. I never do, so I don’t buy the claim one bit that you spend any amount of time reading about things like Leadership and Influence. If you did (and of course, your choice), perhaps you’d hear a little more of what Mr. Shaw is ASKING rather than dwelling just on what he’s “saying” only because it coddles and feeds those “me oh so hard done by” loserism victimhood “poor me” genes that you seem to hell-bent to cling to. :)
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January 19, 2016 at 12:01 am
The Arbourist
@Vern
Absolutely. Funny how one gets used people making intelligent arguments and wanting that to continue.
Fantastic. When intelligent, successful women comment on my blog saying the things that you and JJshaw do, then we’ll have to see then won’t we, but as of yet, that hasn’t happened – just dudes kinda carrying on about how to do things the ‘right’ way. :)
Well, explaining things to ignorant people is what I do. Rest assured I get much practice.
Cool. Handling tough issues in society isn’t for everyone. And really I’m not trying to get him on my side – the majority of dudes have neither the time nor the concern about these issues.
Yep, it is good to be right.
Nah. I’m good though, thanks. Having the expectation that people should know the subject they are talking about isn’t unreasonable.
Lol. Really? Explaining simplistic shit repeatedly is a grind. If you don’t think so, awesome.
It isn’t really about ‘winning’ men over feminism. The sort of changes necessary preclude the notion of ‘winning’ people over.
Thank you, once again Vern, for the wall o’text mansplination of how to do feminism properly. I will take it under advisement and process it with due care.
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January 23, 2016 at 11:15 am
VR Kaine
When intelligent, successful women comment on my blog saying the things that you and JJshaw do, then we’ll have to see then won’t we, but as of yet, that hasn’t happened.
Haha. Of course it hasn’t. That’s because this is a victimhood circle-jerk, and no successful woman would ever spend their time here. As you’ve stated, none have. They’re just too busy being brainwashed, according to you.
It isn’t really about ‘winning’ men over feminism.
Because you all hate “winning” period, apparently. Heaven forbid you actually grow your numbers, convert people to your cause, and make the difference you all keep whining about wanting to see here and yet hoping someone ELSE will actually be the one to make it happen. You’d all far more rather be “right” than be effective, which basically makes all that intelligence useless – that is, unless you want to circle jerk in some private circle about it day-in and day-out.
Why not take a risk, put yourself out there and attempt to lead, Arb? You do it in the classroom – why not do it out in the real world? (Fully expecting you to dodge that question yet again, btw)
And another interesting thing – you’re all about being so “frustrated” that you have to “educate” people here. Is how you treat JJ the same as you treat students in your classrooms? Hammer on them and belittle them and whine to them about how tired you are when they’re looking to understand something?
You’re so bent on being “right” the thought of being “effective” seems to totally elude you. In turn you win no one new to your cause keeping your side’s numbers pathetically low and making any sort of change basically nonexistent.
“Thank you, once again Vern, for the wall o’text mansplination of how to do feminism properly.”
Nice try again, Arb. Nobody’s telling you how to ‘do feminism properly’. Apparently since you’re a man and oh-so-educated you’ve got that completely down pat. Instead, these are just observations calling you out as a complete wussy who hides behind whatever cause he can (what’s the next cause celeb for you, Arb? You going to self-identify as a black woman?) plus a few suggestions about leadership and change based upon men and women who get shit done that aren’t mired in Perpetual Victimhood – ideas which I’m sure will continue to escape you for eons at your present rate.
Last is to back up someone like Mr. Shaw who at least has the guts to voice his opinions in here, even if I disagree with them. Nice for you all to have a corner of the world where YOU can be the bully, isn’t it, Arb, to take out all of your frustrations on that evil “man world” out there and Mr. Shaw, who you’re certain is part of it?
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January 23, 2016 at 11:58 am
carmen
@VR Caine.
Funny you should use that word ‘bully’.
Yet one more screed that illustrates your twisted idea of feminism. Perhaps you should read these through before you post?
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January 23, 2016 at 12:04 pm
VR Kaine
“Twisted idea of feminism”?
I’ve never stated what my idea of feminism is, so what are you trying to refer to?
What I’m referring to was Arb’s treatment of Mr. Shaw, and wondering if he treats his students the same way as he goes after Mr. Shaw, since Arb ffigures he’s supposedly “educating” people here.
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January 23, 2016 at 12:16 pm
carmen
You know exactly what I’m saying. I’ve read some of your comments on other threads, remember?
I would assume that Arb treats his students differently than JJ because he assumes adults should know better than to spout such nonsense. But then, of course we have you, also, to illustrate that it’s not true. ;)
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January 23, 2016 at 12:26 pm
VR Kaine
Remember? Nope. Are you supposed to be somehow memorable in all of this?
“Adults should know better…” Haha. Same intellectual arrogance and b.s. from you and your crowd again. If you can’t handle the “nonsense” (which clearly you can’t), like I said to Arb there’s a “Safe Room” around the corner. Go suck your thumb there.
p.s. Adults also know to capitalize the first letter of their name.
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January 23, 2016 at 12:39 pm
carmen
Keep talking, Vern.
I am wondering where all the angst comes from? Perhaps your inability to be courteous around women results in personal frustration?
Hmmmm. . .
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January 23, 2016 at 12:46 pm
The Arbourist
@Vern
I keep this thread alive now because of the instructional value of illustrating what happens when you let men into discussions about feminism. Do you even remember the OP? Probably not, but that’s okay because really its about making the thread about you and how right you are.
Ever the more proof that any comments section on a feminist article proves the need for more feminism.
I’m not sure you missed it in the last back and forth, but ‘winning over men’ has never been a priority here. The changes that need to happen require women to organize and intransigently force change on society. Men need not apply.
What I do in the classroom and in real life is of no concern to you, nor should it be. The fact that you’re making it an issue seems that you’d rather be attacking my personality rather than the ideas I put forth. I’m very touched you are concerned with the activism in my life, but please try to stick to the topics at hand rather than content of my character. (I suspect that you’ll continue on this line though, because ignoring boundaries is also very typical male behaviour).
We are talking about the same thread right? :> Vern, that is demonstrably what you’ve done and like most male prescriptions about feminism, you’ve failed miserably. If your goal was to demonstrate that men, when their privilege is challenged become aggressive, then of course I would award full marks.
Because dealing with arguments that are fundamentally correct is hard, personal attacks are much easier. Again, if this thread was a clinic on what males do when they are out of facts, it would be pure gold. However, this post was about women, and not about you (well it is now, best intentions and what not) and I’m sorry that you’ve been out argued to such an extent that you think that analysis my character will somehow salvage a win.
You will have to leave the self-identification and related identify politics mumbo-jumbo to the liberal feminist crowd. I’d like to point out that current batch of women and men ‘getting shit done’ are currently mired in the status quo. Thus, looking to them to change a system that directly benefits them is an unrealistic plan of action. Of course, I’ve said this already upthread, but listening, once on your high horse seems to be a challenge.
Yep, I even have a movie coming out its called Perpetual Victimhood of the Travelling Pants. I’ll let you know when the first screening is.
Lol. Boldly asserting the status-quo is now a venerated activity in the blogosphere. I need to get in on this! – I need direction to a Black American blog where I can tell them that racism is *over* and to man-up already and start making a difference!!
It’s almost like I have my own blog or something…. :)
Absolutely. It is one of the best parts of having your own blog. Also, it serves as an educational space for the women here, who are lurking and watching you bloviate on with all your manly importance. It helps them recognize the fact that people like you despite all the gilded talk of ‘leadership’ and ‘getting shit done’ you stand with and perpetuate status-quo, which happens to be what radical feminism is against. :)
So really, I’m glad you have the pompous-assholery turned to 11 for this thread – we all have a part to play in moving toward the liberation of women in our society – it is very important to have clear exemplars of what not to do.
And for that, I thank you Vern.
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January 23, 2016 at 12:50 pm
The Arbourist
@Vern
“Adults should know better…” Haha. Same intellectual arrogance and b.s. from you and your crowd again. If you can’t handle […]”
Vern, for some masochistic reason I let you talk shit to (about) me on my blog. Currently I’m still okay with it (?). Other people though, not so much.
So don’t.
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January 23, 2016 at 12:52 pm
VR Kaine
Haha! There’s that “frustration” thing again. What is it with your kind? I should be frustrated over what, a conversation? It’s your kind that needs “Safe Rooms”, Carmen, not mine, and I imagine with how thin-skinned you are you’ll be heading to one shortly. See ya – enjoy the cookies.
And no, I’m typically NOT courteous around losers who get off on coddle-fests and need “trigger alerts” before they read something, so just as you don’t believe what you THINK is my perspective on things deserves any sort of courtesy from your kind, the feeling is mutual from mine.
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January 23, 2016 at 12:56 pm
carmen
Remember, Vern. There are many people reading your replies. Your petulant foot-stomping and insult-flinging serve a valuable purpose – to illustrate what happens when insecure males are challenged.
Oh, and my ‘kind’ is female. Just thought you might like to know that.
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January 23, 2016 at 1:20 pm
carmen
Something else, Vern. I’m speculating here, of course, but it seems to me that with your attitude you can’t be very successful with women. Perhaps you use the term ‘circle jerking’ because it’s at the forefront of your thoughts, and might have something to do with your frustration?
I hear it’s a lonely – but not altogether unpleasant – job. ;)
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January 24, 2016 at 12:17 am
bleatmop
Holy hot jesus christ. I haven’t followed Thunderfoot since I wrote that blog post about him. It seems he’s turned from a turd sandwich into a shit smoothie with a bile and vomit aftertaste. I’m quite happy I haven’t watched any of his fetid crap since.
Also, good on you for fighting the good fight Arb. This kinda crap is disgusting.
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January 24, 2016 at 7:40 am
The Arbourist
@bleatmop
Thanks. :)
We do what we can around here. It would have been nice if he had just stuck to making video’s about his area of expertise.
Oh well. :)
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January 25, 2016 at 8:06 am
Rebecca Solnit – Who Can’t Take Jokes? | Dead Wild Roses
[…] You can watch Rebecca’s insight in action right here folks on this very blog. Watch how, when things don’t go their way. the fire-works begin – personal attacks, […]
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