Well, not charity in the most traditional sense of the word, but in the sense of regarding arguing with people about ideas and reaching a conclusion or at least more of a mutual understanding of what the other is saying. Inauspiciously, this rarely seems to happen on the internet, as the sectarian nature of the blogosphere and related message boards promote groupthink and a sad lack of charity for opposing ideas.
We can put it into context of the further train wreck of misplaced skepticism about the theory of evolution. My thanks to tildeb for hosting such a informative and useful blog. In the comment section of his article on “Why god’s law must be secondary” we get this gem of comment from 4amzingkids.
If humans evolved from apes or ape-like creatures, when did this happen? And which creatures were involved at that important point? With more than 5000 fossils or fossil fragments of apes, chimps, and humans allegedly showing stages of human evolution, which ape-like animal had enough human characteristics for us to say “this one has just crossed the boundary from ape to human”?
Homo habilis — it’s actually an apeThe short answer is “it never happened,” and the fossils show this.
Lets break down the argument.
1.Humans do not look like apes now.
2. At some point, if evolution is true, we must have changed from “ape” to human.
3.There have been no fossils found of this mysterious half-ape/half-man.
4.Therefore, evolution is wrong.
If, by chance, you are following the theme of this post so far, you know exactly where this is going. Not that we have not seen this before. But for the record, one should be clear. When constructing an argument about a position you do not agree with it is vitally important that you undertake your argument with the strongest version, best defended, most venerated definition of what you are arguing against. In other words, you need to argue against what the BEST version of what an opponent has to offer and not misrepresent or misinterpret what he or she is saying.
This sounds easy. In practice it is not. A great deal of care and attention is required to be charitable to others when arguing with them. The tendency is to construct a version of their position that is weaker than it is and argue against this flawed version. It is also known as constructing a straw-man argument because the arguments you are so handily demolishing are set up by you with the sole purpose of being easy to demolish. Setting up strawmen makes you look bad and rarely furthers debate as you end up arguing with yourself, rather than with the actual positions of your opponent.
Scroll up? Can you spot the strawman construction in 4amzingkids argument? Most people could find the flaw just by going to wikipedia and looking up Evolution.
“2. At some point, if evolution is true, we must have changed from “ape” to human.”
A true grey peppered moth on a tree covered in soot. Point 2 shows a distinct lack of knowledge of what evolution actually is and how it works. If one is to do only a cursory reading of the layperson’s literature about evolution it can be easily determined that Evolution is partially defined as the gradual change in species over time. So of course there is no “half and half” fossil available because one never existed because evolution does not work that way. Whoops!
It is even worse if you base your entire argument on a flawed assumption of what your opponents position actually is. The religious are famous for mischaracterizing their enemies in such fashion.



3 comments
September 18, 2011 at 7:33 am
renetascian
I hate people who can’t see even when it’s right in front of them. You can look at primitive man and see the resemblance, without going through the mental gymnastics. Pretending you can’t see the resemblance between you and your father doesn’t make him not your ancestor. All things come from pre-existing materials, this is the nature of the universe the religiously ignorant try to deny. Iron exists because of fusion of hydrogen and helium in stars, and their death in subsequent supernovae. The basis of their fantasy depends on their propensity to remain ignorant, because education destroys the fantasy and forces the childlike mind to embrace reality. Ironic that their own religion trains them to retain such characteristics as it is necessary to maintaining that faith. Faith is destroyed when you think critically, because you realize the error of concluding without evidence, and the harm of leaps in judgment can cause. If you ask me, faith is a lazy asshole’s excuse to avoid having to actually do something, learn something, or think about something in depth. Faith is the surest way to circumvent reason, the one redeemable quality of being a human over an animal. But, that is just my opinion. I just pray the ignorant die off, or become educated soon; I want to see our world grow and advance not plummet into the dark ages.
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September 18, 2011 at 7:56 am
The Arbourist
Faith is destroyed when you think critically, because you realize the error of concluding without evidence, and the harm of leaps in judgment can cause.
It is tough to break free though if it is all you’ve know. I’m not speaking from personal experience, as I had the good fortune not to indoctrinated at an early age, but from the struggles of those around me who did have to struggle and fight to break free from the doctrines of religious thought. From what I’ve seen, it is unpleasant at best.
I want to see our world grow and advance not plummet into the dark ages.
Much is going to depend on how the US deals with the inequality in its society. Religion only pacifies the unwashed for so long, then they get righteously angry and start burning things down.
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September 18, 2011 at 8:05 pm
renetascian
It is tough, even for a non-indoctrinated person. Christianity has an excuse for every position, but once you realize this it should highlight it’s fallacy. If you say, logically it makes no sense they say, “God works in mysterious ways”. You say, my conscious reason tells me this is wrong, “That is the power of the devil”. If you say anything, there is always an excuse, some mystical magical reason why you are wrong if you disagree with Christianity. The entire concept defies logic. It’s a giant logical booby trap, with twists, turns and pitfalls designed to circumvent reason thus why it still exists today. If not for that feature it would have died. But I think there is a reason why atheism is growing, and it’s because our world is demanding greater levels of expertise and education out of us. This education is informing us of the nature of the world we live in with evidence, with physical reality and as a result the fantastic and unprovable are loosing ground.
But you are right, this contest of wit “or lack there of” is hardly over. The most dangerous power of religion is that it can override reason and perpetuate violence because of it’s on righteousness. 9/11 polarized the religious and non-religious in this country, which is why you have these nut-bag Christian Politicians everywhere trying to cure the gays, block their rights and assert that somehow we are a “Christian” nation? It’s completely ludicrous if you actually learn about the founding fathers, or about the religious revival of the Cold War which is where most of the “God Complex” American has came from. You can argue the accuracy of history in our society, but be ready for a lynch mob if you question the accuracy of history in the bible. Christians fundamentalists are out of touch with reality and I hope they don’t get a hold of this country, and I’ll do all I can to prevent that.
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