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“i really don’t understand how you preach that women should all love each other but not accept transwomen. i do see some of your points about men claiming to be trans lesbian and not actually be either but.. i still think transwomen are women.. i had a lot of respect for you until now..”

 

awaitingthematriarchy answered:

“I’m sorry to hear that of course, but I stand by my beliefs. ‘Woman’ is not an identity that you can opt in or out of – it is a politically neutral fact of biology. It’s the word that describes adult human females. Women can exist in infinite variations of personality types and aesthetics, but whatever our differences, we’re all united by our shared biology, which in turn confers a shared experience as being socialised as female under the patriarchy.

However, if we accept male-bodied people as ‘women’, then the meaning of the word changes. What does it mean to be a woman if we remove it from the state of existing as female? What does it mean to ‘identify as a woman’ if you are biologically male? What are you identifying with? If you can’t identify with the biological reality of being a woman, and you can’t identify with being socialised as a female, then the only thing that you can claim to identify with is the more abstract concept of femininity, which isn’t the same thing as womanhood at all. Does ‘woman’ become redefined to mean ‘anyone who identifies as feminine’? Where does that leave women who don’t identify with the social expectations around femininity? Aren’t they women?

How can we combat (or even vocalise) sex-based oppression if our biological sex is now irrelevant to womanhood? And let’s be clear, as a female I don’t have the option of identifying out of sex-based oppression. If all women everywhere collectively announced that we no longer identified as women, then it wouldn’t somehow magically stop misogyny. It would still be the same 50% of the human population being raped, abused, and exploited. The very act of a transwoman identifying as a woman and demanding recognition as such is an extension of male privilege. Women don’t get to chose our oppression under patriarchy.

So no, I’m afraid that I love and respect women too much to pretend that I view transwomen as anything other than gender non-conforming males. I don’t hate transwomen, and I believe that they should be able to live their lives free from violence or harassment, and I support their right to dress and present themselves in whatever way makes them happy, but I don’t believe that the act of doing so fundamentally changes their sex. My feminism is about prioritising females and lesbians, and combatting sex-based oppression. I wouldn’t be able to do that if I believed that womanhood was something as flimsy as something that anyone can ‘identify’ into.”

Brave words in the current climate of fake news and factual-relativsm.

Another interesting snippet from the conversation over at VW’s:

 

Arbourist:  “Humans, like most mammals are sexually dimorphic.”

VW:  This is a discriptive label we use in an attempt to best explain what represents the majority or general experience. That’s not my opinion – it’s a fact. Sexual dimorphism in humans is not a law, and it’s not even true for every individual, is it?”

Arbourist:  A man expressing typically feminine traits is still a man. ”

VW:Yes, of course. And a man who feels they were assigned the wrong sex and therefore gender at birth, based on nothing more than casual observation of their external genitalia, now has the freedom within many of our societies to become a woman.


 

I just happen to be reading a short essay called On Language and Erasure by Hypotaxis and this passage jumped out at me”

“But since this is a post about the notion of “erasure” and “thought policing,” I wanted to point out a couple of excerpts from the article – which was, in fact, written by a female:

Sex is based on the body, but biology is a branch of science and science is also a social construct and really what I’m saying is that your sex is essentially a label a very educated person slapped on you at birth using as many contextual clues as they could garner at the time about your DNA. Sex is not immutable or unchangeable or somehow “intrinsically” defined by our bodies; it’s more that science and medicine have put words in place to define sex and thrust it upon us – and that they’re often inadequate at capturing the full spectrum of diversity swimming around in the big ol’ sea . . .

 This is the kind of bullshit, circuitous, narcissist-logic, swamp of nothingness fuckery being sold to women on behalf of males who would prefer we not acknowledge reality. The attempt to convince women – or anyone for that matter – that science is a “construct,” in the same way gender is a “construct,” in a world where most are bat-shit insane idiots because we are no longer allowed to express a rational thought,  is dangerous. And how is this any different than the crazy people who run around denying evolution? Or climate change deniers? The incentive for Creationists to deny evolution, and for those who deny climate change is the same as the incentive for the trans/queer/gender worship lot who claim science is merely a construct: the scientific principles inconvenience them, hurt their feels.

“But if Jesus didn’t live with dinosaurs then . . . then . . . then FUCK YOU EVOLUTION ISN’T REAL!”

“But if my gas chugging SUV that I really, really like is bad for the environment then . . . then . . . then FUCK YOU CLIMATE CHANGE ISN’T REAL!”

“But if my penis isn’t part of female anatomy and I really, really would like to be a girl then . . . then . . . then FUCK YOU BIOLOGY IS A SOCIAL CONSTRUCT!”

Gender Studies is anti-intellectualism dressed up in academese for the benefit of males. Period.

And yes, science and medicine have put “words in place” to define things. Scientists and doctors use words particular to their disciplines, they have language that means specific things like “molecule” and “cancer” and “female” and thank fucking god for that. A doctor’s job is not to acknowledge every special nuance of your unicorn self. A scientist’s job is not to placate your fragile feelings.

Reflected in the Autostraddle is also the way in which trans/queer/gender-speak has reframed true feminism – now considered “radical” – to be “trans-exclusionary” (i.e. does not prioritize males/make religion of gender). Radical Feminists – referred to in the modern gestalt by the pejorative “TERF” – are those who are concerned with the welfare of women and girls, who are interested in the liberation of women, the end of gender, and the dismantling of patriarchy. Trans/queer/gender studies speak has appropriated the word so that it means, “don’t be mean to males”; trans/queer/gender studies has taken the tools of the oppressor – gender roles, pornography, prostitution and called them “empowering.” Trans/queer/gender studies folk work tirelessly to ensure women cannot speak truthfully about their lived realities, for fear it might alienate males.”


 

What twinged the comparison for me during my conversation with Violet is what seems to be the willingness to slip into a very liberal relativist reading of facts that do not agree with her position on human sexual dimorphism.  The strategy seems to be to get away from facts and go to the idea that everyone has their own equally important set of facts and the disagreement between these two ‘world views’ is where the argument should be – as opposed to actually arguing the original fact based argument.

It makes so hard to find any sort of common ground when everything seems to be relative and words mean different things to different people.   :/

 

 

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